The Messer Log

[Joel]

Drag!!!  makes me NOT want to look under my floor...  Let us know how it goes.

[bmock50]

I know thats what mine has to look like. Keep us posted on the steps and tricks and whatnot you use.

[RonT]

Needs a new floor, preferably composite, forward bulkhead is a foam stop, so foam could be injected ahead of the bulkhead. Unfortunately the foam after 25+ years is probably damp too. Thats the bad news, the good news is that this is a doable project that will cost a lot less than a new boat. I walked through the New Orleans Boat Show Saturday evening with my family $65K for a ski boat??? My son said, Dad we could buy (4) used Skiers, rebuild them & each of us have a boat for less than one new one!   

[phil]

I walked through the New Orleans Boat Show Saturday evening with my family $65K for a ski boat??? My son said, Dad we could buy (4) used Skiers, rebuild them & each of us have a boat for less than one new one!

It seems that the they (at least in some cases) are pricing themselves right out of the market. I mean, how many people can really afford a 65K boat? You have to have a lot of extra money laying around... This is one reason we went with a Moomba Outback when we decided to purchase a late model boat. It's the only one that is even close to our price range! And still very expensive in my book. 

[Messer]

boat sits... I'm in denial... if I wish it away (floor problem) it may happen...

[Mike Harry]

Its really not that hard brother, especially if you dont mind cutting the "L" seat and fabing it back in after the floor repair.

[backfoot100]

boat sits... I'm in denial... if I wish it away (floor problem) it may happen...

Yup, you definitely need a new floor. If you own anything that has a wood floor, this is just considered normal maintenance. It's going to happen sooner or later. Face it, it has to be done. I feel your pain though.

When I redid my floor I soaked everything in CPES before assembly. I bedded the floor to the stringers with an epoxy caulk and I used epoxy putty to seal every joint and the edge around the hull. I screwed the floor down to the stringers and then removed every one of them one at a time, shot the holes with CPES and screwed them back in. I had 2" holes drilled in the floor to pour the foam back in. After the foam cured, I carved out each of those holes at least a half inch deep and sealed them with the epoxy putty. Then I put three layers of glass over the top of it all. If I ever have to drill into the floor, I seal it before I screw anything into it. The complete floor is basically now an epoxy composite and I should never have to do it again. I didn't want to just replace it and end up doing it again in 10 years. I went out of my way to make it completely watertight and as epoxy soaked as I could get it so it couldn't rot from the bottom.
The floor under the observer seat was already getting soft when I bought the boat and it was only 6 years old at that time. I replaced the floor when the boat was 13-14 years old. It has now been 12-13 years since I redid the floor and it's as solid as the day I put it in.

As a side note, when you redo it you can get rid of those ankle-bangers (straps) holding up your swim platform. Geez, I got bloody toes just seeing pics of those straps. They should have been your first clue that the floor is rotting out from under you. The brackets for the platform are through-bolted and they're under floor level. As soon as the bolts got stripped out (or pulled out)the watertight integrity was compromised and the rot already started at that point. The straps were just a band aid until the rest of the floor got to the point it's at now.

I hate to be bearer of bad news but I would bet the plywood encased in the transom is probably completely rotted too. The only way I know of to fix that is to replace the transom but Ron, I'm sure knows of alternatives if there are any. When I replaced my exhaust tips recently, the plywood encased in the transom was completely dry, but there have never been any breaches in my transom either. When I replaced my floor, I replaced the platform bracket bolts and lock nuts. I glassed in the nuts on the inside so they couldn't possibly back out (even though they were locknuts) and I completely sealed every breach in the transom. Then I put a clear silcone seal around the edge of the platform bracket and each bolt head. The only problem with this installation is that the platform brackets are not removable at all without going through a lot of work. Like I said, I went to extreme lengths to make sure everything was watertight. It's far better than the factory ever could have been and I'm convinced it'll last long after I'm gone but only time will tell for sure. I'm very optimistic about it anyway.

[Messer]

Hey brother I appreciate the info! I am taking it all in and getting the nerve to go out and start cutting. I do have to wait for the upholstery shop to get their part done and then I'm free to jump in. Until then, I'm going to a better place in my mind... it looks a lot like this past summer, have a look....

the last picture- my cousin who had never bought anything used in his life fell in love with my old American Skier. He tried his best to find one or buy mine (on short notice) and ended up buying the first fixer inboard he could. We'll bump the pontoon for Nautique room this summer.

Ya'll just bring a few tents and we'll have the reunion at my house.

[backfoot100]

Its really not that hard brother, especially if you dont mind cutting the "L" seat and fabing it back in after the floor repair.

I've never heard of doing it this way. Seems like it would be a lot of exra time trying to fab it back together and fit properly. Not to mention that it has to be a lot harder working under the bow with the deck still there.

I removed the whole upper deck. Remove the rub rail and then make sure that you have everything disconnected from underneath the bow and the aft deck.
Speedo pickup tubes from each speedo, steering cable, throttle and shift cable. There is a quick connector at the engine for most of the wiring to the dash. Pull it apart and pull the harness back from the bow. Running lights, bildge pump overboard tube, Gas tank fill and vent hoses and then the blower hose. The air vent tubes running from the bow vent to the bildge have to come off then. When you're ready to remove the deck, get a couple friends and it lifts right off. Set it on a couple of sawhorses and you have complete access to the entire hulll. I didn't remove the engine or tranny. I got a large plastic bag and covered them up because it will get dusty.
Now you're ready for some real fun. On the plus side, you'll become intimately faliliar with how your boat is built and even more familiar with virtually every subsystem you can think of. Then you're done with it and get it back on  the water, you'll feel an enormous sense of pride knowing you did it yourself.

Now is the perfect time to do it too. If your cousin has a CC that you can use while you're redoing your Skier, you'll still be able to get out on the water. Best of both worlds!!!!

Your Skier looks very cool by the way!!!!!

[Mike Harry]

That's the way I did it to Backfoot, but some folks don't want to take on the challenge of splitting the Hull from the deck, I've seen it done that way. Its just an alternative.

[Messer]

  Progress...slightly. Upholstery on hold due to ...well, I don't know, she is just slow. So I got outside and started ripping with hands. The previous owners boat guy simply laid plywood over the weakened original floor and glassed it in, kinda. I ripped that out with ease along with the carpet. Water on the stbd side on top of the foam. the foam there looks yellow still. The port side foam has water and it appears to have lost its integrity and soaked in.
  From here- cutting tool to get the rest of the floor out, pull the tank and cut through to fix the dive platform, figure out how to cut the L seat and be able to re-attach it. I'll  surely pull all the foam as well.
 The good news so far is where I can check, the stringers are solid even with the water intrusion from years.

Enjoy my pain!

[kahunadon72]

Keep at it, Messer - be encouraged that you have others on this board that have done this before (myself with a 17' outboard runabout).   If you need to replace stringers/transom material give SeaCast a consideration (transomrepair.net).

[Messer]

FOAM... a four letter word with extreme emotional consequences.

Tip for getting foam out- I spent two hours and made about 2ft headway… I then took my wireless sawsall and criss-crossed the foam in squares about 2in deep, then hit it with the claw on the hammer and little squares like ice cubes just jumped out. The rest of the 12ft came out in about 25 minutes.

Stringers even though sopping wet (foam was water logged I should say) seem to be strong. I do have one area just in front of the motor where some jackleg drilled a big ass hole about ¼ wide in the stringer years ago to mount something. The hole seems deep and empty but the fiberglass around that stringer area is still strong. May pour some hardening goop in it…I don’t know. Most of the fiberglass is still hard and strong on the deck but the wood underneath mid beam was rotten under the glass, some unbelievably is still dry and strong from 1984. Cutting it all out though and will go back with ½ inch marine grade. The teary eyed point for me was cutting the L seat, hope I can make it strong when it goes back in.

[RonT]

I have some very strange looking home-made tools for removing foam, from modified air-hammer chisels to shovels to 10' long wire whips for the air drill.  Bottom line is to get it all out & use whatever you have to do it.....good job. Key to success when laminating anything during the repair is making sure it is DRY. I use fans to blow air into the stringer cavities to dry them before re-foaming or doing any glass repair.   

[kjerchinger]

Messer,

   That is one great looking Advance ! from the floor up of coarse. you have already jumped in with both feet and you will be successful. how could you not be a resource like this blog. I recently thanked Ron for all the help he provided me during my floor replacement this past fall, while I was at it I should have thanked Phil for the awsume job he has done putting this site together. personally, I would not have a clue how to do what he does, just glad he was inspired  to do so !
     I just posted some pictures on the gallery of my floor replacement in progress, you may find them helpfull, ( Keith's 85 Advance ). You may also like the way I mounted the swim plateform.
    There are a lot of different ways of doing things, my advice, ask a lot of questions, combine all the knowledge, and do it the best you can with the resources you have.
   Ron has a how to replace a floor tutorial somewhere in this forum, hands down if you get it from Ron you cannot go wrong, my guess, that guy never cut a corner in his life !
   now that my boat is back in the water i can tell you replacing my rotten floor and water logged Foam was the best thing I could have done. the boat is as solid hitting a wake as it could be. the wake is smaller do to the boat being hundreds of pounds lighter, and the Hole Shot, unbelievable !

   good luck, and keep us posted on your progress

     Keith