The Messer Log

[Messer]

The foam came out pretty easy with the criss-cross cut and hit method...

Keith, how did you cut the glass so close to the hull? I've been using a jigsaw and sawsall. I have about 1in to 2.5in ledge all the way around. The stern is where I'm having issues since I want to whittle out the old glassed in bracket holders.

got my aluminum for brackets and center deck structure kinda like Mulberrrys...

My foam was waterlogged and heavy... probably not gonna put anything back in... whoever sold foam to the USCG could sell screen doors to a submarine captain!

Mulberry is a dead man for making this seem so easy....

[Mike Harry]

F.Y.I. to cut the glass all the way to the hull, I used a belt sander and like a 50 grit roll. Cut it clean and fast. Just my .02 cents

[kjerchinger]

I put a Long blade on my sawzaw, as long as I could get maybe 10''. then I could bend it and follow the hull. then, Like Mike, I used a Belt sander, Make sure you wear a mask as you do not want to subject your lungs to that Fiberglass dust ! if you have access to a grinder different attachments are available for it as well, like a wire wheel.

   as far as omitting the foam, Ron wrote somewere that if the boat ever sunk you may have a tough time collecting from your insurance company if they find it was modified and does not meet USCG specifications.  I would also thing it would be a benefit to get the boat to draft higher in the water and create a smaller wake. as a short line slalom skier I consider this Paramount, though it might not be important to you. installed properly it also provides structural properties as well. if you decide to install the foam, I can walk you through it at that time.
   I can tell you that installing the foam was the most fun and not difficult, part A and B of the Foam would not be more than about 300.00 in material.

[Messer]

Does anyone see a problem with not extending the deck al the way to the stern on the sides? I'm gonna install the new platform brackets soon and I want to have access to them in the future if I need to tighten or just remove them to buff the hull. I was thinking about leaving a 6in gap from the deck board to the stern in that area. thoughts?

[Mike Harry]

Can't say if its right or wrong but I did the same thing so I could reach everything coming through the transom if needed.

[kjerchinger]

I like the idea of closing the floor up, preventing water from getting under it, once it gets down there with or without foam it is not your friend.
take a look at the gallery. I posted a pic of what I did. it is a 2"X4"X1/4" aluminum Plate, with a threaded 3/8" hole in the middle. I attached it to the hull with 3M 5200 adhesive.
   after spreading 3m on the entire back side of the plate hold it in place on the inside of the hull, have someone else hold the bracket in place and thead the bolt through the hole in the hull threading it into the plate. snug it down till the adheasive begins oozing from behind the plate. do not over tighten it, you want to maintain some adhesive behind the plate to hold it in place and also create a water tight seal. let this cure for a week before thinking about removing the bracket. in the mean time, you an cut the floor tightly around the plate if it is above the floor.
 Fiberglss the floor into the transom to prevent water from ever getting below. it is a big enough problem with condensation below the floor, you don't want to worry about any water above the floor pouring back into a hole everytime you take off.

 

[RonT]

Flooring should tie in the transom at least in the corners over the outside stringers, leaving a large "pocket" at the transom in the inboard stringers to access platform bolts is perfectly acceptable, this is how we did it in the later years but you should glass in the "pocket" & add a drain tube to the center to allow water to drain.

[kahunadon72]

Sorry this is so long...

I would stress that you should be sure to have limber holes in both the stringers and frames or make sure existing limber holes are adequately sealed and clear of debris.  This will allow ensure any future water trapped outside the stringers has a way to drain into the bilge.  I don't know why more boats don't have them or don't have more of them.

In my old 17' runabout stringer/frame/floor replacement project I built 4 limber holes in the stringers (2 in each) and glassed them up really well.  Each frame (wood that's perpendicular to the stringers) also got 1.5" diameter limber hole in the lower corner where they came into contact with the stringer.

Once the frames were glassed in place, this created individual compartments in which to pour the 2 part foam and let it cure individually (easier but more time consuming than if I had poured the entire boat at once).

Here's where I got a little creative.  Starting with the aft-most compartment first, I put a temporary 1.25" dia pipe passing through the first frame limber hole and pushed it all the way aft up against the transom.  As I poured the foam in that compartment, I rotated the pipe so that it would not get foamed in place but would create a void up against the stringer-to-hull joint so that water can easily move forward and aft along the stringer and find the limber holes to drain into the bilge).

Once the foam cured in that particular compartment (a matter of minutes), I slid the pipe forward to the next compartment (leaving a couple inches of pipe in the previous compartment for overlap).  Repeat until that side of the boat is completely foamed all the way forward.

Essentially this leaves a small void the full length of the stringer's outboard side of  the stringer-to-hull joint.  If any water gets under the floor out there, it should drain to the lowest point of the compartment and then find a limber hole to drain into the bilge.

[Messer]

Thanks for the info, taking it all in... I'm so strapped for time but I will get it finished before May so I can drop her in the water (or suffer three little girls kneeboarding fury)..  I have found my engine "model" end game. I would venture to say I may not get that done in time... have a look, it's out of a 77 Fish Tique.

[phil]

looks nice. Are you getting those exhaust pipes too?

[backfoot100]

Hey Messer, the Motor looks nice but a there could be a couple issues here if you aren't aware of it.

If that motor is coming out of a CC, I would assume that the engine is reverse rotation unless it came with a 1.23 tranny which wasn't an option until '89. But again that was an option, the standard tranny was 1:1.

I don't know if A/S's were optioned with RR engines but I have to assume that yours currently is standard rotation like mine is. If that's the case, you'll have to reindex your tranny to spin opposite and then you'll be forced to get a RH prop after everything is all done. Or another option is getting another tranny like a 1:23 that opens another can of worms.
Putting a RH drivetrain on your boat could change your handling characteristics considerably but Ron may have to verify that aspect of it.
I just wanted to make sure you were aware of this possible SNAFU before you went ahead with it.

[Messer]

A little more progress.. got the transom wood whittled out. It took longer than the rest of the the deck. broke the airguide pickups.. hope I can just put some air tube behind the copper tube to the transom and then use the airguide pickups (tournament pitot assembly) on skidim. Sounds too easy..

Keith- I like your bracket and now that I have dug in and whittled the wood out I notice it looks like your wood is still there. Do you think I need some more reinforcement for mine as I am going back in with an aluminum bracket as well but without any wood between the bracket and outer hull. It seems to be a big void though.   Anybody's thought appreciated before I jump.

Gon- where did you get the multi colored American Skier sticker?

[Messer]

Ron, Mulberry, Mike, Harry, Joel… other boat nuts-  a few more items to bounce and ask before I go to the store if you don’t mind indulging me. Some may be redundant, sorry- scatterbrained at the moment.

Odd random questions-
Mulberry’s transom bracket looks great and I have mine ready, but think I will get the plyboard, glass new squares and then place the aluminum over that. I think that will make it the sturdiest even though I hate using wood back there, thoughts? http://www.amskierboats.com/forum/index.php/topic,101.15.html

Do I have to glass in the below deck (underside of the plyboard) or can I just resin it in?

Mulberry- did you buy ss screws and bolts a few at a time or did you get a complete box of different kinds? If so, where?

Mulberry- how much matt did you use…read, how much do I need to go buy? If I read your post right you have three layers of mat on your floor (24oz, then 18oz, then 15oz) and once dried you went back with 1708 tape (6”, 45/45) to seal the edges or mate the deck to the sides better.

Q- couldn’t I just use the 24 or 18oz and run it up the sides a few inches?
And to confirm, you also used the “peanut butter” concoction to fill in gaps (prior to glass matt) between the deck and sides due to “un-straight” cuts, right?

Q- Mulberry- how many sheets of board did you buy? Was there any left over for odd jobs? Can I get it at a local Home Depot or Lowes?

Ron- I am planning on going back with ½” marine grade plyboard, .. do you see a need to add support under the new board (read bulkheads) or with the connection on the sides via 1” ss screws and peanutbutter/mat overlap be enough?

Thanks so much for you guys patience with me…

[kjerchinger]

Sorry for th delay,

when in doubt, I would install the wood backer if you think you need it.
but treat it as you would the floor, first coat of resin, thin, about 35 to 40% Acetone, this will allow penetration into the wood, a trick i learned from Ron. second coat, straight resin.
  apply the same proceedure on the floor, both sides, matt not required on the underside.
  if you need more advice on the fiberglass materials give me a call, I would be happy to help, Ron dialed me in on this, I can forward the info on to you.
  Keith- 630-878-8226

[Messer]

Thanks brother, that's what I am doing, it worried me to death... I am hopefully picking up the plyboard and resin in the morning and will get at it this weekend. I may call, thanks for offer!